Sunday, November 10, 2019

Christopher Blount


Christopher Blount

 

USE TEXT IN BOLD


00:48:13:00


BLOUNT

 

My name is Christopher Blount B L O U N T and I am a

district court judge in the state of

Michigan 36 district court city of

Detroit.

 


VINCE


00:49:30:00

 

How long have you been a judge?

 

00:49:32:00

 

BLOUNT

 

I've been a judge for a little over two years

now.

 

 

00:49:38:00

 

BLOUNT

 

Before I became a judge I was, I

had a law practice that extended about

eight years I had been licensed for

about eight years before I became a

judge and that practice consisted of me

being a solo practitioner under the law

focusing on probate and criminal issues

and I worked for a brief period of time

at the defenders or the state defender's

office which did was a nonprofit that

handled a lot of court-appointed work in

the -- in Wayne County

 

00:50:17:00

 

BLOUNT

 

Well when it comes

to study in the law their history is

weaved into that in particularly in law

school when you look at cases that are

in the land use class the local

government class constitutional law 1

and constitutional law 2 criminal law

at all kind of builds on a history and

in particular in law school when we're

studying Supreme Court cases it builds

it builds on precedents that have been

set over years and years and years so I

think someone that is in the legal

profession especially one that tiptoes

closer to a lot of constitutional issues

whether a judge or an attorney it serves

you well to read a history book every

now and then.

00:51:19:00

 

BLOUNT

So the funny thing is when I was in law

school there was one of our lecture

halls had this big portrait of Thurgood

Marshall on the wall off to the left

and I'll be doggone if not every single

day I had a class in that room I always

look at the portrait of Thurgood

Marshall. Thurgood Marshall has been a

subject of some Hollywood productions

one most recently I think Chadwick

Boseman played the lead -- I thought that

movie was great because we associate

Thurgood Marshall with one particular

case and that's the Brown v. Board but

this particular movie explored a

lesser-known case that he was a

part of which really shows that he was a

multi-faceted attorney before he

became a Supreme Court justice and I

believe there was another kind of

one-person show that was done by

Laurence Fishburne that I actually saw

it at a screening at the Charles Wright

museum here in Detroit and that was very

it was impressive and impactful as well.



00:52:46:00

 

VINCE

 

How much further

do we need to go what are the obstacles

challenges that African-Americans still

face in the legal system if any now that

we have African-American judges and all

that type of thing you would think you

know there's equality of fairness speak

to that.

 

 

[00:53:06:00

 

BLOUNT

 

So when you talk about African

Americans in the legal system

it's a, it's a pretty it's a

multi-faceted conversation to be had

from are we being treated fairly in the

legal system, are we properly represented

as professionals in the legal system?

Those are all fair questions to be asked

and there's definitely a historical

precedent for asking those questions.

Then you have to look at history as well

as in any particular here in the city of

Detroit where I'm located as a judge.

This is a the city where the Ossian

Sweet case took place which was going

back to talking about constitutional law

and how it kind of drew the line on

local ordinances and land use and

property ownership that was a big case

that was based on that and an African

American physician being disenfranchised.

Then you look at the work of the heavy

lifters who have come before me like a

Thurgood Marshall -- inspirational,

educational -- a lot of young

African-American -- excuse me, a lot of

young attorneys and young judges period

pay attention to the scholarship of

someone like Thurgood Marshall - present

party included - the city of Detroit and

where we're located now I think has been --

African-Americans have made a lot of

great strides as far as representation

in the legal system here in the city of

Detroit but it's not the same across the

nation and I just hope that a lot of

people no matter who you are you just

don't look at the micro example of what

is around you and think that that

replicates all across this nation

because it doesn't.
00:54:56:00 end]

 

 

Whenever I hear young

people, somebody got accepted to law school you

know some people “Oh we have enough

attorneys!” - I say, no I'm like great, come

on we'll make room for you whether you

want to represent your people in some

form of law rather be probate law

criminal law transactional work you can

either you may be a representative for

African-Americans in that place in that

discipline of study or you may have

African-American clients in that

discipline of study but I say

come on you know pursue your

undergraduate studies come on to law

school and as far as you being a

community advocate in the community that

we know our rights please keep it up

keep up the good work we have a lot of

work to do we have a lot of steps

continue to make and I just hope I can

be a part of that

 

 

00:55:48:00

 

BLOUNT

 

so my advice about the legal system

whether you are caught in it in some

type of way whether it be a civil issue

or a criminal issue or whether you're

trying to be a working professional in

the legal system one thing I would like

to tell people is that whatever obstacle

you're facing there's probably someone

who has already overcome it so don't get

down on your luck look at history and

you might be able to find your present

-- the solution to your present problem.


 

00:56:41:00


VINCE

 

If you when you're in circles outside of

you know 36 District Court where you're

interacting with other judges, different ethnic

 

Backgrounds things like that, is there

a sense of class or something like that

where African-American judges can kind

of feel or sense you know some type of

strain?

 

00:57:01:00

 

BLOUNT:

 

Well I would say my experience so far as

being a judge in the in the state of

Michigan 36 District Court is my home

jurisdiction city of Detroit that when I

do interact and rub elbows and my with

my other colleagues in this state and

let me just point this out about this

state ‘cause because every now and then we

have to have statewide judicial meetings

and something to speak about the

diversity of the state of Michigan is

that at these meetings there are people

who are judges with jurisdictions that

border Wisconsin and then you have

people who are judges with jurisdictions

that border Indiana and Ohio then you

have everyone else in between and it's

very interesting to be in that group

they are the representatives

representation of African-American

judges is concentrated into Detroit

Wayne County but we're also represented

in Muskegon, Midland, Lansing area, Ingham

County, Genesee County as well where

Flint is and I love those meetings just

to talk to the diversity of diversity of

judges throughout the state of Michigan

and a lot of the other judges who I

would never see on any occasion never

have set foot in their judges

jurisdiction

probably never will set foot in their

jurisdiction they seem just as

interested to hear about what's the

latest development 36 District Court or

how we're handling cases how we're

taking a procedural approach to things

and it's like -- I don't want to quite

say fraternity but it it it is like a it

is it's a position that we are

privileged to be in and a lot of us

definitely do respect being in that

position and we definitely do take

advantage of opportunities

network each network with each other.

 

00:58:54:00

 

VINCE


We talk about the history, and I know,

 

Having worked with the Charles H. Wright Museum


You know, it seems like every time I go in there

 

You know, I kind of get hit with a wave of emotion

 

Thinking about what they went through and how you

know African-Americans or blacks weren't looked at as

humans you know and so now being able to

actually be you know a judge you know

how much of an impact do you reflect on

where we've come from and now we're

actually -- you're actually in a position

to execute the law and yeah just kinda speak to that.

 

00:59:42:00

 

BLOUNT

 

so you just

referenced the Charles Wright museum

that is an institution the Charles

Wright museum is an institution of

Education and inspiration when you when

you go and you set foot in the Charles

Wright museum you see all those exhibit

exhibits that reference the past and

history and we I think it's hard to deny

as a black person in particularly grew

up born and raised in the city of

Detroit when you see that and you see

that these are the fount this is the

foundation of your ancestors that you

know you have a strong foundation to

work from and my predecessors like I

said in the judiciary such as Thurgood

Marshall just mean that this means

that I should be unafraid to do some

heavy lifting myself now that I am a

judge as far as it being a competent

professional judge but not forgetting

that you have an opportunity to

uplift and empower your people to do

bigger and better things

the -- and the hurdles that people have

overcome you know it is it is my mother

and my father god bless them they raised

me to be the man who I am but

the reality is both of them were born

during Jim Crow they are old enough

where their very early years in life

they were born during Jim Crow now they

were both born in the north but my

grandparents have stories about the Jim

Crow South and I think it's a lot that

that now you're interviewing me in 2019

and I sit before you a three-time

college graduate who's a judge that says

a lot for where we can go it says a lot

for where we are and where we can go and

I just think it's incumbent upon me to

always remember the platform that my

ancestors have given me within my family

and without and that I as I move forward

it is upon me to lift as I climb. - 01:02:00:00 end]

 

 

 

01:03:00:00


VINCE


Where do we need to go from here?

 

 

01:03:03:00


BLOUNT


well I think as a

community there's still a lot for us to

do for ourselves there's still a lot of

ways that we can move forward

I just just to move us for one thing I

would like is for us to not forget the

values that our predecessors and our

ancestors had that got us to this point

and to adhere to those values to keep

moving forward

I think pursuing education has a lot to

do with that there's definitely benefits

for having a formula you know there's

definitely benefits to more and more

people in the community having a formal

understanding of everything there is in

the world let's not forget and lose

sight of the ideas of economically

empowering our communities to do things

for ourselves even despite any obstacles

that may be in front of us I just think

loving yourselves not being afraid to

build a family keep God first and we'll

be okay. -01:04:06:00 end]

 

 

01:04:11:00


VINCE

and we talked about you know the

trailblaze the history you know people

that came before us

we know about the major that the names

we hear all the time Martin Luther King

Harriet Tubman and I don't know how far

back because I know you know I said I'm

really interviewing you from modern day

legal standpoint but I want to kind of

get your sense on what -- what were the

let me ask this way -- what were the legal

parameters that white men had to honor that

protected African-Americans if you know that,

 

I don’t know if that’s a fair questions.

 

 

01:05:04:00


BLOUNT

 

Well I would think that

that in the, the as as African-Americans

have existed in this country in slavery

released from slavery move forward lived

under Jim Crow and have gotten to the

position that we're in now—

 

 

01:05:40:00


BLOUNT

 

I was just so as

uh as African-Americans have existed in

this country in slavery and outside of

slavery and living in Jim Crow and then

getting to the the point that we are now

I think that it is fair to say where we

have had allies and our journey in this

country and those allies were definitely

people of other races and ethnic groups

and but I think that if you look

throughout history and look at the

stories of people who have contributed

to the abolitionist movement contributed

to fighting Jim Crow and the civil

rights movement I referenced a value

system I think that a lot of those

people who became allies to the cause

they did it because of a value system

they did it maybe because it was a maybe

of some type of spiritual direction that

they felt felt that this was a cause

that they should take up it was just and

it was righteous

I don't think that those alliances could

have been made by way of legislation I

still don't think that you know a lot of

there a lot of laws passed nowadays that

are anti-discriminatory

equal protection type laws I think it's

fair and reasonable for government both

of federal and state government to want

to have though and and local ordinance

is to want to have those on the books

but I think is it's the it's the it's

the value system of us as a people and

that comes to really how we treat each

other and how we love each other and I

think that we as a people should not

lose sight of that and uh and I you know

when I say we as the people I mean

broader than just African Americans we

as Americans should not lose sight of

that and how we deal with each other and

understand each other's differences and

try to uplift and empower groups when we

see that they're on a righteous cause.


 

01:07:34:00


VINCE

 

With all the resurgence of racial tension

 

I don’t know if it’s a resurgence or if

 

We’re just exposed more to it you know

 

And you got groups like Black Lives Matter

 

That has emerged out of a lot of police brutality

 

And things of that nature. What do you say to

 

where we are in regards to racial tension that’s going on

 

and then address the legal

aspects of -- like talking about like a

Black Lives Matter is that in your

opinion a necessary group to help move their

 

agenda forward, is that something that’s good for us?

 

 

01:08:20:00


BLOUNT

 

Well I think

in in kind of addressing the racial

tension and racial well I shouldn’t say

differences because differences is part

of what makes America great but the

tension and maybe disagreement that we

may have that we think are based because of

somebody's race it's just something we

need to do in my personal experience I

was called a nigger to my face and it's

maybe 10 days after I got my acceptance

the letter to law school and it was I

believe Barack, Barack Obama may have already

 

--no, Barack Obama was not

president yet but I don't think that

person has now changed their opinion

about life in their view of

African-Americans

because Barack Obama did two terms as

president but I think that when it when

it is it's really about a tolerance and

an understanding that we need to have

for each other.

Most people in America are hard-working

blue-collar people most people in

America when they get off work they just

kind of want to go home make sure the

kids get their homework done go to bed

at a reasonable hour wake them up take

them to school the next day I say that

to underscore that most people in

America I wish would understand that we

have more in common with each other than

we do have differences I guarantee you

right now there's someone in the black

community, a white community, Middle

Eastern community, Latin community I

guarantee you there's a conversation

going on right now where somebody's

complaining about taxes in each of those

communities that reflects that we're

really more similar than we are

different

and once again I do support the idea of

anti-discrimination laws being on the

books well I should say I support the

idea of that not necessarily the form

that they always take but once again is

our value systems and having the human

contact we need to stop being siloed

kind of meet and greet each other don't

just because somebody don't you don't

have to say that the other side of the

street is that's where the Latin people

live know that's where your fellow

citizen is your fellow human beings your

fellow taxpaying citizens live it's not

they're not there they're not just not

their own City you don't live in your

own City you're all we're all part of

the same community I wish we would learn

and understand that but going back to

what you said about the law and I think

that human beings love and respect for

each other really can transcend any

legislation or any type of law

enforcement there is.

 

 

01:11:18:00


VINCE

 

So if you were trying to help somebody

 

Who doesn’t look like us understand

 

What we face for example, like I mentioned

 

Before, I had to teach my son

 

If you get pulled over, man you gotta have

 

Your stuff like this, you gotta have your hands out

 

From a legal standpoint if you’re trying to help

 

Say a Caucasian person understand what we face

 

From your standpoint, how would you

address that?

 

 

01:11:57:00


BLOUNT

 

Well talking about the

African-American experience in

referencing what you said about police

contact I think it's a it's a fair

question to be posed and I look at it a

little bit differently maybe it's cuz I

went to law school maybe not maybe

because there's a there's a some law

enforcement in my bloodline with my

father and grandfather I mean I maybe

look at it a little differently when you

when so nowadays are being more and more

publicized because of YouTube because of

the camera in your pocket now the

question I ask is before we start

drawing racial lines before that started

not to say that's not to happen but

before that started I examine the

behavior of the police through a lens of

professionalism and I think it's a fair

question to ask when it comes to any and

all police encounters and we have to

examine what the police are the police

are they’re state actors they’re state

actors who've also been issued an

instrument of death by the state being a

gun so where is the professionalism in

these encounters? Where is the veteran

leadership in these encounters? I think

there's a fair question to ask because

not before you start to examine any type

of racial overtones which have been

recorded on body cams and things of that

nature so that's not an unfair question

to ask but examine the behavior of the

officers and there's this one case

that I think I think the name of the

case was or the name of the gentleman

was Eric Garner and I think he was

selling bootleg cigarettes and seven

officers responded to this and it wound

up with him being choked to death.

Where is the professionalism? Where is

the leadership? You mean to tell me seven

officers with probably over 100 years of

experience came up with chokehold for one

person who and the event is on video

he's not armed

never balled his fists up just didn't want

to be arrested on a case where he could

have been ticketed at the scene so in a

case where there was not a hard policy

of custody of taking someone into

custody

he winds up with seven officers

chokehold - death - Where's the

professionalism? Where's the police

decision-making that says seven officers

conclude this case with chokehold and

death on someone that's unarmed so

that's a if if if if we examine the

behavior through professionalism and

leadership and police protocol then when

you start looking what what exactly is

the use of -- use of force

requirement and why they did this

officer abandon that requirement he's

outside of what was required and use the

use of force then the questions are

asked well why did you do this when

there's three officers that respond to

the scene but only one shoots and the

other two don't so that means two out of

three chose not to use deadly force when

you did…

Why? because obviously your colleagues at

the scene they may support you in

documentation after the fact but their

behavior does not support your response. -01:15:53:00 end]



01:15:52:00

 

VINCE

 

But my question was more directed toward

 

We’re trying to educate the students and trying to

 

Help them--

 

 

 

 

 

01:15:58:00

 

BLOUNT

 

so I guess what I'm saying is that in we

know that the media kind of builds these


up as “white officer black victim” let's

let's examine it as citizen state actor

first and I think if you take the

lens of you take the lens the racial

lens off and you examine the

behavior of a state actor a government

actor who's been issued a gun and by the

way no matter who you are government

actor or layperson when it comes to a

gun you cannot make a mistake. -01:16:36:00 end]

 

 

01:17:21:00

 

FOXWORTH

When you think about the legal system

And individuals obviously like Thurgood Marshall--

 

BLOUNT

--heavy lifters

 

FOXWORTH

--whose shoulders do you stand on? And what

Was it that paved the way for you?

 

 

 

01:17:34:00

 

BLOUNT

Well with me practicing

law for a little over eight years and

then becoming a judge when I look back

at the history of people ancestors

predecessors in this field I looked at

Thurgood Marshall he is a major standout

also look at some local attorneys here

like in Detroit there there are some

local heroes I have to mention Cornelius

Pitts is a very well-run or well-known I

should say very very well-known attorney

who's still practicing

in the city of Detroit to this day I

look at a Federal Judge Hood who has

moved from the court that I am currently

in which is a state court at the

district level and move through all the

way to being a federal judge that you

know that carries a lot of weight I

think it's great that her and I are

colleagues at the same time because it's

somewhat inspirational as well and Anna

Diggs Taylor is another local judge

that's carried a lot of weight and one

thing that I probably have done that

most people in law school have done but

probably the average admirer of someone

who like Thurgood Marshall has not done

as I actually said had to spend three

years reading opinions that he authored

and one thing that I kind of maintained

as a judge now is that his opinions were

very easy to read and Here I am all

these years later after law school when

I give my decisions in court I try to

create them in plain English just

because I had to read what he authored

years and years ago and there's and

there's a lot of a lot of attorneys or I

should say attorneys and some of them are not

attorneys but have graduated from law

school they do a lot of legal

scholarship they write on a lot of

issues like civil rights, environmental

justice things of that nature and I

think I think Van Jones who's a real

popular person on CNN I think he

graduated from Law School and I've read

a lot of his scholarship on

environmental justice issues you know

there's just a countless number of

predecessors and ancestors who have

moved on who have been in the legal field

and I understand that they have given me

the foundation that I'm that I make

moves on now myself and I'm very

appreciative of that and I just that in

one of my lecture halls at Wayne State

University in the law school off to the

left is a huge black-and-white portrait

of Thurgood Marshall and I said I looked

at that portrait

every single time I had a class in there

Man, because he was the only black person on

The wall, amongst all the other pictures. -01:20:38:00 end]

 

 

01:20:38:00

 

FOXWORTH

Final question then, just as it relates to the legal community

The law enforcement community, and African Americans

Typically always has been a challenge there. “No snitchin’,

don’t talk to police, don’t—you know, stay out of the legal

system”—we won’t get into how many African Americans

are imprisoned these days and whether or not that’s another

conversation—the judge in Pennsylvania that was selling

individuals to the warden, and on and on and on. All of these

things, as it relates to the legal law enforcement

community and the African-American community there’s always

been some degree of uneasiness I won’t even say tension

there’s just been this uneasiness. How do we get past that?

 

01:21:38:00

 

BLOUNT

So the you're correct to say that the

rev-- relationship between law

enforcement community criminal justice

system and African-Americans has not

always been completely harmonious I will

say that for us living in the city of

Detroit we have kind of an example of

how to move past that I mean in when you

see what's hitting the media and these

locations that are hitting the media

about these eruptions in the in the

tension between the citizens and law

enforcement the city of Detroit does not

really come up and I think a lot of that

had to do with the leadership of Coleman

Alexander Young who was a mayor for 20

years and obviously he's now long gone

as mayor but it shows how when you have

someone who can get in political power

and have be a man of conscience how they

can impact things 20 years out.

The integration of the police force I

think is something that a lot of other

jurisdictions need to look at the idea

of community policing is something that

a lot of other jurisdictions need to

look at the way that African-Americans

have been able to be represented in the

judiciary is something that other

jurisdictions other jurisdictions need

to look at I would say in indeed in

Detroit Wayne County we're very well

represented but even with that being

said anybody that wants to run for

office might tell them go go go get it

go try please we'll make room for you

but I think that having the right people

of conscience in political positions can

help bridge that relationship can help

relieve those tensions and understand

that I think the end game of any chief

executive of a city is is to want to

have a competent professional police

force I think that all citizens of any

city would respect and want a competent

professional police force

so those things that are indications of

a lack of professionalism indications of

discrimination are what are the things

that people in leadership need to make

sure don't occur within their police

force and the citizens need to

understand that the end game is a

competent professional police force and

that anyone in leadership is still going

to need the help of the citizens to help

develop that competent professional

police force I mean end of the day your

tax dollars are paying for those police

officers if that law enforcement agency

wants to have you give some type of

input on how to help mold and shape this

department and bridge the gaps please

participate. -01:24:31:00 end]

 

 

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